Hiya! Does anybody know where I can find other kinds of buttons that would fit the LXR? I'm thinking buttons of the more rubbery kind, and maybe with a better fit.
Moshang's caps are fairly standard - I've got a couple of hundred of them in different colours from ebay/china. But they fit standard size tact switches. The square buttoncap-holding parts on the LXR switches are just a little bit smaller than any other switches I've ever come across. The LXR button caps would fit tightly on Moshang's switches, for example.
edit: Actually, I just checked and the LXR switch caps are too small to fit on Moshang's switches.
There is a metal case on the way from Adrian (the one making them for the MI Shruthis and Ambikas).
I think he said he uses 1mm sheet metal, so that would leave about 3.4mm .
But, the buttons are domed, so I don´t know if the 4.4mm you give is the max button height or the start of the dome, in that case it would be hard to use them.
Max height, but even 1 mm is enough - tactile switch travel is less than 1 mm.
I want to say that maybe you cant'u use it with standard enclosure/spacers but if you measure everything and made custom enclosure - everything will be fine. And don't forget about 8mm standoffs and slim LCD/OLED.
I am quite happy with my Batch 1 LXR in it´s original case. I am just thinking this might be cool for future LXR batches as an upgrade to eliminate the button cap problem.
the omron swithes would be an alternative. they are the same as the TL1100, but with a slightly bigger plunger. But they have a little plastic nose on the bottom for which there is no space on the LXR PCB. Otherwise I think the footprint is the same. I'm not sure about which button cap would fit then, but the selection should be higher. But this damn plastic nose would also call for a redesign since some of the PCB traces are routed in the place of this nose.
Hello, could anyone please point out what the exact total height is, so from PCB to the top of the switchcap to fit Frank´s acrylic case?
Also, these switches "Racon 12" with outer laying pins from RAFI have the exact footprint from the e-switch ones and have "unlooseable" switch-caps (buttons) in several heights and diameters. Datasheet for Racon 12 switch and caps: https://www.distrelec.de/ishop/Datasheets/Racon_eng_datasheet.pdf For anyone who will use his LXR a lot this is like a "must-have", you get a minimum of 1.000.000 switchings instead of 100.000 for the e-switch brand.
Since they are only available in white/bright gray anyone could just spray-paint them with a high quality paint/lacquer in any color.
Also remember: you can cut off the pins/legs of the switches first, then you need only to push out the pins/legs (while heating), this applies to any de-solder job of course.
Hmm, how many switchings are the stock LXR switches rated for?
Hello Rudeog, if they are original e-Switch ones 100.00, asibay ones 10K to 50K or even less. I know from the past that 100K rated switches won´t last long on gear I use a lot, 1-2 years max.
Yes sure, it is more interesting for new builds or when a full or partial replacement would take place. Also for the average noodler 100K is a lot, if pressing the switches with a gentle 160gram force My switches usually wear out fast, because I do not always hit all the buttons gently, so from 100K switchings it goes fast down to unreliable...
Hello, could anyone please point out what the exact total height is, so from PCB to the top of the switchcap to fit Frank´s acrylic case?
Also, these switches "Racon 12" with outer laying pins from RAFI have the exact footprint from the e-switch ones and have "unlooseable" switch-caps (buttons) in several heights and diameters. Datasheet for Racon 12 switch and caps: https://www.distrelec.de/ishop/Datasheets/Racon_eng_datasheet.pdf
Well, I just figured out that those switch-caps (in German: Stössel) won´t fit/serve by 1mm. In full down position they would reach 11.94mm +/-0.2mm and in normal (non pushed) position they would "stay" at 12.55mm +/-0.1mm.
The problem is that they should have at least 13mm height from PCB in normal position, this means they will be like 0.45mm under the case top... If you have a look at Schrab´s illustration above, showing a section from the side, you´ll understand what I mean.
BUT...
For a metal case from Adrian they would fit better, as they are in lowest height 11.94mm +/-0.2mm from PCB (including the switch of course) and if the metal case will be 1mm thick, the 0.94mm +/-0.2mm will be just enough to prevent the switch cap to not to go under the metal case and get stuck.
OR...
For an aluminum case or just aluminum top-panel, even up to 3mm thick, they will be a perfect fit. How? Just have the holes for the switch caps made with a 30degree bevel or rounded edge and you will have a super-smooth transition between panel and the switch cap.
Hello Julian, do you have the exact MFG part number of the respective omron switch? There are so many and without an exact part number I don´t know which one you mean. Also any datasheet from omron site I can´t open, nor download, they won´t open :-/ Any other PDF opens fine though.
the tl1100 that come with the kit have 160g force and have a 3.4mm (3.3mm) plunger the omrons have a 3.8mm plunger
while looking over the datasheets i saw there is also an e-switch variety of the TL1100 called Tl1100A that is supposed to have a 3.8mm plunger as well... didn't knew this before
Comments
But they have a little plastic nose on the bottom for which there is no space on the LXR PCB. Otherwise I think the footprint is the same. I'm not sure about which button cap would fit then, but the selection should be higher.
But this damn plastic nose would also call for a redesign since some of the PCB traces are routed in the place of this nose.
Also, these switches "Racon 12" with outer laying pins from RAFI have the exact footprint from the e-switch ones and have "unlooseable" switch-caps (buttons) in several heights and diameters.
Datasheet for Racon 12 switch and caps: https://www.distrelec.de/ishop/Datasheets/Racon_eng_datasheet.pdf
For anyone who will use his LXR a lot this is like a "must-have", you get a minimum of 1.000.000 switchings instead of 100.000 for the e-switch brand.
For further switch-cap/button options, other than those available at Reichelt.de, have a look here: https://www.distrelec.de/pcb-switches-racon-8-and-12/rafi/tappet-for-the-racon-8-and-12/en
Since they are only available in white/bright gray anyone could just spray-paint them with a high quality paint/lacquer in any color.
Also remember: you can cut off the pins/legs of the switches first, then you need only to push out the pins/legs (while heating), this applies to any de-solder job of course.
I know from the past that 100K rated switches won´t last long on gear I use a lot, 1-2 years max.
Also for the average noodler 100K is a lot, if pressing the switches with a gentle 160gram force
My switches usually wear out fast, because I do not always hit all the buttons gently, so from 100K switchings it goes fast down to unreliable...
In full down position they would reach 11.94mm +/-0.2mm and in normal (non pushed) position they would "stay" at 12.55mm +/-0.1mm.
The problem is that they should have at least 13mm height from PCB in normal position, this means they will be like 0.45mm under the case top...
If you have a look at Schrab´s illustration above, showing a section from the side, you´ll understand what I mean.
BUT...
For a metal case from Adrian they would fit better, as they are in lowest height 11.94mm +/-0.2mm from PCB (including the switch of course) and if the metal case will be 1mm thick, the 0.94mm +/-0.2mm will be just enough to prevent the switch cap to not to go under the metal case and get stuck.
OR...
For an aluminum case or just aluminum top-panel, even up to 3mm thick, they will be a perfect fit.
How? Just have the holes for the switch caps made with a 30degree bevel or rounded edge and you will have a super-smooth transition between panel and the switch cap.
there's 10mm standoffs + 3mm frontpanel.
the expected lifetime of the tl1100 switches is 100k cycles.
regarding the omron switches, B3F series:
the are also available as a long life version that would give
min 10,000,000 cycles
here is a datasheet
http://www.mouser.com/ds/2/307/B3F_0811-26083.pdf
do you have the exact MFG part number of the respective omron switch?
There are so many and without an exact part number I don´t know which one you mean.
Also any datasheet from omron site I can´t open, nor download, they won´t open :-/
Any other PDF opens fine though.
I have not bought and tested them. So my information is from the datasheet only
But it should be
B3F-4050 -> General-purpose: 130 gf, 3.000.000 cycles
B3F-4055 -> General-purpose: 260gf, 1.000.000 cycles
B3F-5050 -> long life: 130 gf, 10.000.000 cycles
B3F-5051 -> high reliability/gold plated, 130g (probably much overspect for this usecase)
the omrons have a 3.8mm plunger
while looking over the datasheets i saw there is also an e-switch variety of the TL1100 called Tl1100A that is supposed to have a 3.8mm plunger as well... didn't knew this before
"Unkaputtbar" 10.000.000 cycles !!!
slightly different datasheet version
http://cva.stanford.edu/classes/cs99s/datasheets/D22B3F498.pdf